WAR (Warhammer Online)

Originally posted by skydragonren

Originally posted by ColdSun

Skydragonren,

I really don't agree that most ex-WoW players are going to return for WOTLK.  I played WoW since release until about a month ago.  I won't ever be back.  Fini.  Done.  Adding 10 levels and making all the gear I earned with their grindfest worthless isn't going to make me want to come back for more grindfest.  WoW's PVP is a joke.  So I've heard they have done some nice things with WOTLK, but its still just WoW.  On the other hand, I also played DAOC from its beta and several years.  The RVR was always better than the junk WoW had to offer in PVP.  The fact that you re-subbed to DAOC tells me you must have liked something about it yourself.

Do I think it will kill WoW?  Not a chance.  Will it take away a good number of players permanently?  Definately.  I'm one of them.  Could it possibly hurt WoW's big bank?  For sure. 

After all, what did BC do for a lot of us?  The old world PVE zones are unused ghost towns now.  All gear we earned in classic WoW that we worked hard for became worthless to many BC green items!!!  They tacked on Arena for the pimpfest bragging rights, which is nothing more than a glorified Quake Arena.  DAOC/WAR RVR is so much more.

 

Oh! no doubt DAoC was the best PvP game this world has ever seen, I won't dispute this fact. Mythic made a lot of terrible decisions regarding the game, clusters, and server types, which killed the game to what it is today. Even still nothing matches DAoC's pvp game.

WAR RvR will murder WoW PvP hands down, I'm not disputing that fact either. I would never dream to boast otherwise.

That being said PvPers are still a minority when compared to PvEers it is sad but true. Which is why WAR can't dent WoW. It is a game based on DAoC which is based off WAR of realms, not questing or raiding.

Like I said I'm no WoW fanboi, the game is good, even the haters can't dispute the fact that its a good well polished game.

I resub to my previous games just to think about the past, however since beta I have never once unsubbed from WoW.

I told myself whenever a game that comes out that is a true equal to WoW or even better than WoW, I would unsub.

Sad to say but that day has never came, and I have played every MMO to be to released even F2P since UO.

I still hold true to that as well, when a game comes along that I find is truly WoW's equal I will quit WoW.

Yeah, I don't think me and you are too far off the mark on opinions.  I know many WoW players on my server who feel the same way as you.  There is no doubt there is no currently released game as good as WoW.  A fantastic achievement in gaming.  You also agree that the PVP is very poorly implemented.  Although I think I came off as sort of a PVP nut, I'm not.  I love a good PVE session and working with a guild as much as the next guy (my time in EverQuest is still some of the most fun MMO I've ever had).  One thing I liked about DAOC was the ability to do both PVE and PVP (RVR).  Trials of Atlantis killed the game for many DAOC players, including me, but if that expansion had been better I might STILL be playing that game.  So I'm hoping that WAR will improve on DAOC's PVE and have that fantastic RVR that I enjoy.  Better graphics and a new engine just adds icing on the cake for me.  I also hold to my word I will never play WoW again.  I'm one of those people who put entirely too much time into it and its lost all entertainment value for me.  My account still exists and I could always go back, but I just won't.  It's like quitting smoking for me.  You either do it and stop talking about it, or you keep smoking.

Originally posted by sabutai22

Originally posted by onlinenow25

FACT - You have done no research on the game.

FACT - You know nothing about marketing.

 

First of all you do not know me, so assuming you "think i do not know" is just naive. Second, give a talented group of programmers, artist and musicians 20+ million to make an MMO title and they will deliver perfection! Mythic is only trying to get a "bite" of WOW player base in order to make cash, period!

 

Umm...if musicians and artists made an MMO it would be cancelled because it would be about drugs and sex and killing beyond beleif...mostly gangstar MMOs would come out, and new wave or w/e would just make a BIG painting...so no, they would not make PERFECTION :)

Originally posted by Locklain

Originally posted by Shohadaku

FACT - War will make millions in a safe game design method with little risk to pull in some cash for profit of a company.

Seriously, do you blame them?  Look at what happened to AoC trying something different.  Now all people do is bash it.  The only companies you will see release drastically reformed ideas will be indie companies, and most of them will fail on their journey to stardom.

AoC wasn't unsuccessful for the ideas that they had. In fact, many of their ideas turned out really great. People bash AoC because the company running it has been flat out lying about their game for the past 6 months (for the most part that's what people are angry about, at least).

I don't blame Mythic for going the safe route. I have no doubt in my mind that this game can become good. But that's about as far as it will get... "good" ("Good" and "Popular" are two different terms that both WoW has and WAR can achieve). A game can't become "great" without adding something new to the table. Sure, it's good for them to go safe in the long run. But bad for us. We need innovative companies or else the gaming industry will not evolve.

FACT - Very few game companies will ever have the balls to design a true innovative game NOT based on this safe WoW formula.

True innovation is hard to come by, you know it, I know it, and so does everyone else.  Then you have the form of innovation in the minds of an idiot.  Look at Brad McQuade for example.

I'd rather see a game fail for trying something new then a game become successful for not breaking the mold. And I'd be even happier if a game became successful for trying something new. Innovation is everywhere. It's a matter of if you use it and have a make or break chance or go with the safe WoW formula.

FACT - Big corporations can care less about you, or innovation, they care about $$$

Fact indeed, you will never change this.  Corporations are out for there for your money and they always will be.

I think we all realize this, and it's not really a bad thing. Why else would the corporations be doing any of this if it weren't for $$$? It's like asking why do you do your job 10 hours a day? I don't care if they're making money from us, good for them. What matters to me is if they actually use that money to at least somewhat improve the game. It's really all a matter of how far a company shows that they care about the customer and their game as much as they care about the profit.

Originally posted by ColdSun

Yeah, I don't think me and you are too far off the mark on opinions.  I know many WoW players on my server who feel the same way as you.  There is no doubt there is no currently released game as good as WoW.  A fantastic achievement in gaming.  You also agree that the PVP is very poorly implemented.  Although I think I came off as sort of a PVP nut, I'm not.  I love a good PVE session and working with a guild as much as the next guy (my time in EverQuest is still some of the most fun MMO I've ever had).  One thing I liked about DAOC was the ability to do both PVE and PVP (RVR).  Trials of Atlantis killed the game for many DAOC players, including me, but if that expansion had been better I might STILL be playing that game.  So I'm hoping that WAR will improve on DAOC's PVE and have that fantastic RVR that I enjoy.  Better graphics and a new engine just adds icing on the cake for me.  I also hold to my word I will never play WoW again.  I'm one of those people who put entirely too much time into it and its lost all entertainment value for me.  My account still exists and I could always go back, but I just won't.  It's like quitting smoking for me.  You either do it and stop talking about it, or you keep smoking.

Yeah the thing about ToA is very true.

Trials of Atlantis was the nail in the coffin for DAoC. They seen games like EQ, FF11 and thought that forcing grouping for PvE content and dungeons was a good idea.

However where they made the biggest mistake was linking it to the RvR game which was DAoC greatest strong point.

Powerhouse guilds who could get into the ML raids and get all the Artifacts were dominating PvP and leaving the little guys to get massive frustration and the feeling of being not able to compete.

They were right in a way.

So trying to copy another games PvE aspect when they already had the most solid PvP game was a mistake, DAoC would have done superb had they only made the 2 aspects separate or at the very least just made the Arti's/ML's easier for the little guys to complete.

Lesson learned tho I guess because it cost Mythic about 60% of their subs or more.

Anyway WoW's PvP has it's moments it can be enjoyable, however it suffers from HORRIBLE balance issues. With the addition of Arena the classes needed to be MUCH more balanced but instead they seem to have made them worse. Giving the already easy mode classes even more power to dominate the game.

Me for example, I play a mage, hunter and paladin.

It seems though that to dominate arena you need a rogue, druid, warlock, shadow priest, or warrior.

None of which I play or have a desire to play. So arena isn't very fun for me since I get destroyed by the above team combinations.

BG's at least give me some pleasure as they are much more team oriented and a good bg of players can yield really good results if they work as a team.

Still DAoC and soon to be WAR's PvP will murders WoW's I have no doubts about it.

I just don't think it will hold much a candle to WoW's still very dominating PvE content.

Shrugs lol guess we will see tho, I am going to play WAR after release as I said I play them all to give them the honest shot.... Even the horrid AoC.

Someone please shoot me for ever giving funcom my money /cry.

I find it interesting how everything is a "WoW" clone now days. There are lots of posts saying how new games "copy" from WoW. When WoW first came out, I seem to remember things in WoW that were taken from EQ, and DAoC. They were the good things, but still, Blizzard did not totally invent anything new either, they just polished up on some of the things already out there. There were some new things in WoW that added a nice touch. Blizzard has done the safe "copy" some ideas and add a few of their own.

---

Originally posted by skydragonren

---

Originally posted by GreenChaos

---

<Mod edit>

---

 <Mod edit>

---

 
...
WoW has one of the hardest end game content's on the planet. Which is why only a handful of the best guild in the world have completed Sunwell to date.
....

---

OP

I don't think people don't "get it" I think people don't care. You obviously enjoy WoW so you stick with that. On the other hand alot of us want some meaningful PvP/RvR and the majority of us haven't seen that in an MMO for a good while now.

      The big thing which WAR does so well to me is they added many of the aspects you expect in end game to the entire stream of events. Major battles which anyone who wants to can jump into are always going on. No looking for groups. Just jump in. That in and of it self was a HUGE difference from WAR for me.

     Meh, I dont really want to discuss why people don't get it