General Discussion

Originally posted by tsitluc

Uhhhhhhh   no?   You're not right. AoC engine is NOT older than Darkfalls.  It's a brand new state of the art engine. Just because it may have been build on the base of an older engine doesn't mean anything, It has to do with what version of DX it supports , what features it supports etc and the Dream World Engine is DX 10 and supports all the latest features.

Nope, AoC's engine dates back to 2000. sure, it's had parts of it rewritten, but it's still an old engine. same with Darkfall. it's a common but naive & uninformed mistake to assume old engine equals bad graphics -- it's not that simple.

Also, AoC's support of DX10 is still in development and months away from being live.

And yes i was right. Re-read what was written.

Originally posted by openedge1

EQ1 Graphics

Staged machinima style excitement.

People are so easily fooled.

When I see real people playing, and hear real peoples opinions, then vaporware will not come to mind here.

EQ1 gfx lost credibility there

Originally posted by Ozmodan

"Personally i think it's going to be epic - a fantasy-based MMO like EVE on steroids. There's so much stuff to do -- build cities/houses/props, territorial conquest, REAL world PVP, mounted combat and cavalry, naval combat and high seas piracy, hardcore PVEer/raider, explorer... the possibilities are only limited by imagination."

Ah...let's wait to see what the game provides when released, just because the features mentioned are on the website does not mean they will be implemented anytime soon in the game.  It usually takes years to get a feature set like that working correctly.  I would rather they have what is in game working then a bunch of features that are there that don't work.

With the small staff they have, some features are going to be way down the road.

 

tasos stated it is feature complete and working as youc an see the ship and buildin destrction isnt up to par but the feature still works

Originally posted by downtoearth

Originally posted by openedge1

EQ1 Graphics

Staged machinima style excitement.

People are so easily fooled.

When I see real people playing, and hear real peoples opinions, then vaporware will not come to mind here.

EQ1 gfx lost credibility there

yep, comparing DF graphics to EQ1 == zero credibility. not to mention the DF video was made using real people, and finally, machinima requires a full-featured graphics engine to make.

one of the worst and most uninformed trolls ever seen on mmorpg.com, impressive.

Originally posted by Ozmodan

Sorry, but Eve server technology is so far advanced over anything Adventurine can afford it is not even close and no one even knows what Adventurine is going to use yet.   It is just obvious that they won't have the funds to invest in top end server technology like Eve uses.

1. It's Aventurine. If you don't know enough to spell it right then don't assume you know about their server technology.

2. They have plenty of funds to do whatever with servers. Some people assume they are trying to rush because of a lack of funds - they have millions in cash (borrowed) and they secured this cash only recently.

"Aventurine SA is an online game developer and publisher based in Athens, Greece that was formed in October 2002. Aventurine SA is currently developing Darkfall in addition to research into game and simulation technologies. Aventurine recently obtained a €20 million convertible bond loan from Marfin Bank ."

http://www.glossary.com/reference.php?q=Aventurine+SA

That means no rush.

I joined MMORPG.com a long time ago in the hopes of finding a good place to discuss Darkfall. I did some reading here and decided that posting back then would do me know good because the majority of what I was seeing was vehemently against Darkfall. Back then it was mostly people spouting that it was vapor.

Since it finally appears that Darkfall is coming out I still see a mass if malice toward Darkfall but now it seems like the vapor trolls are spouting a new line... outdated graphics and that they can't possibly have put in all the features they claim. I've said it before and I'll it here now.

If Aventurine gets even 1/4 of their claimed features into this game at release it will still blow everything out there today right to perdition.

You know what I find really really funny? Every single person who posts a malicious comment about Darkfall probably either works for a competing company or will play Darkfall when it's realeased. They will for no other reason than see if they were right or not for themselves. They will either love it or hate it... but not for anywhere near the reason they spewed all over these forums.

See you in Darkfall. I'll be the one munching on your entrails and looting your stuff.

Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by Ozmodan

"Darkfall server tech is more advanced than Eve in this respect, because DF can do dynamic resizing of zone sizes, as well as being distributed over a multi-PC server cluster"

Sorry, but Eve server technology is so far advanced over anything Adventurine can afford it is not even close and no one even knows what Adventurine is going to use yet.   It is just obvious that they won't have the funds to invest in top end server technology like Eve uses.

As to storage, Eve uses Ramsam storage for all databases, I don't know of another MMO that has invested anything close to what CCP has invested in their server farm.

Here is a blurg on Ramsam:  http://www.superssd.com/products/ramsan-400/

 

I'm talking about server tech not server hardware. Darkfall server tech is more advanced than EVE's - i know because i'm a veteran programmer who codes large-scale scientific applications designed for distributed server farms so yeah, i know this stuff inside out because i could code it myself.

 

DF haven't made any statements about what hardware they'll run, so it's pointless to chest-beat about it. suffice to say SANs are hardly anything to get worked up over. It's worth mentioning that EVE needs to spend more on server hardware because the game is almost entirely implemented in Python, a non-compiled (scripting) language that is slow and requires tons of memory.

 

So, to recap: Darkfall server tech can resize zones dynamically and redistribute these split zones to other, less-loaded nodes in their cluster. EVE uses fixed-size zones, and zones cannot be split/resized, nor redistributed. This is why EVE zones often crash when too many ships jump into a single zone -- their server tech can't redistribute the load so the node crashes. DF should not suffer from this limitation, making 1000v1000 battles possible on the server side, though it's highly unlikely that clients will be able to draw 2000+ characters at acceptable FPS though (this underscores why DF has gone for simple character model graphics over bling).

It is really a shame when someone supposedly knowledgable in this industry completely goes off the deep end.   Firstly, if you took the time to read, CCP changed the fixed clusters with the code changes last November, servers now dynamically adjust to load.   The problem CCP has is even when one server is dedicated to a system, it just can't keep up with the number of objects which is significantly increased by the number of drones everyone puts out.  Sure the client is written mostly in Python, but the server code has been mostly rewritten in C++.  Actually stackless Python is more efficient than compiled code in some applications, it does threads far better than most compilers do, You should take the time to read up on it.

Secondly the only thing you are relying on is a few comments by the Adventurine devs on their website, an extremely weak argument to say the least.  Especially considering the amount of disinformation they have put out.  In concept their code should work well, we will just have to wait and see if they can walk the talk at release.
 

You can count on me pointing out the lag fests, 200 x 200 fights will be when the game releases.  I will enjoy explaining again why hardware is just not up to this yet.  Your simple character models will only help on the client side, they do nothing for the server side at all.  Not very smart to try to use a client issue in a discussion of server performance. 

I just hope they can handle 100 x 100 battles without too much lag, that will be far better than most MMO's achieve today.

This is amazing how people forget themselves playing Battlecity or Mario, or may be shooting ducks at Dendy/Nintendo consoles and PRAISING For SUPER MEGA Graphixx leet shit.

We've been playing Ultima Online for almost 4 years! And it had amazing graphix! oh... wait? It was not. But the ammount of freedom u could do was just THAT much. For fuck sake, i bet some of u are still playing world of warcraft, u log in each day, each evening, and yell at the general chat "OMG IM BORED!" "LF PUG RAIDIN" rofl or u go and wipe in some shitty instance just wasting your time man, cuz u haven nothing else to do but grind and wipe.

I hate people saying that Gameplay is more than Graphix, or that Graphix is more than Gameplay, since those things can't be devided. It is both that makes the game good, and damn Darkfall is good. :) gg