All Posts by singsofdeath

Originally posted by Alienovrlord

Originally posted by singsofdeath

Originally posted by Pyrostasis

Thats the key right there. Even with THOUSANDS of testers AoC and WAR still bombed, yet DF is going to attempt to do better with significantly less. Any software dev will tell you that bugs are easier to find with a large tester base. The more people you have the more stable you will get.

DF is hamstringing itself by working the way it is.

 You forget that DF has PAID testers. Profession testers who are obviously 100x more effective than any wannabe Beta_tester that is randomly invited from the public. I mean, these guys are pro's right! They can test in ways that conventional testers can't even think about! They can simulate EVERYTHING tens of thousands of betatesters could possibly do and think and attempt in this game. 

PS: If you find sarcasm, you may keep it.

 

I noticed the sarcasm but the problem is there are many Darkfall followers who would accept the above statement as being logical and correct.  No seriously, they do just because it's the company line handed out by Aventurine.

Using the same logic Darkfall should never had to worry about ever needing to release patches because those expert 'professional' beta testers will surely uncover all the bugs so there won't be any need for any patches. 

But who knows, maybe Aventurine has discovered some brilliant way of internal beta testing that can replace large numbers of 'civilian' testers hammering at a piece of software.     If they do you can bet that  lots of other software companies will be knocking at their door next.

We'll see in a month.  

 

 

 

I know DF followers accept it. I know they think it actually may work. It is one of the things I am highly sceptical about, but hey, as you said, maybe Aventurine will show everyone how it is really done. If they do, hell yeah, they'll be the big subject for other companies.

As you said. We will see. It's not much more time after all, so we can all just relax and sit back and see if Aventurine's recipe of making an MMO is gonna work out.

Originally posted by Pyrostasis

Originally posted by originalegg

Originally posted by Pyrostasis

Originally posted by downtoearth

Originally posted by Pyrostasis

Originally posted by mcpoopypantz

Originally posted by Pyrostasis

Originally posted by TenSpotting

They said open beta will end in early Dec. Correct?

I am kind of confused really.

Isn't the whole point of having an open beta to allow anyone in?  i.e.  "open" beta?

Or does open Beta start in early Dec?

 

Im pretty sure...for something to end... it has to start first.

 

yes and it still can end in dec though

Not and have any form of high quality stress test and time to fix the issues that would pop up in  time. Folks apparently have forgotten that stress tests are critical to a game's success, and its pretty obvious that darkfall has less than a 1000 testers at the moment.

You need at least 5 - 10k testers for a good stress test, and I think most of us who arent drinking the Koolaid will admit they have FAR far fewer than 1000.

Lets say they start the test Monday.

That gives them 5 weeks to get the folks in, get the client dled, registered etc. Test the content, find the bugs, implement fixes, test fixes, release fixes, etc. That is of course assuming that they are planning on keeping with the  december deadline.

 

most open beta are 2-3 weeks long

You responded to the above with that... Yes I understand open betas are usually 2 - 3 weeks long, but usually they are run after a lengthy and populated closed beta test...which, its painfully obvious darkfall hasnt done.

 

  didnt seem to help AoC and WAR out that much.

 

Thats the key right there. Even with THOUSANDS of testers AoC and WAR still bombed, yet DF is going to attempt to do better with significantly less. Any software dev will tell you that bugs are easier to find with a large tester base. The more people you have the more stable you will get.

DF is hamstringing itself by working the way it is.

You forget that DF has PAID testers. Profession testers who are obviously 100x more effective than any wannabe Beta_tester that is randomly invited from the public. I mean, these guys are pro's right! They can test in ways that conventional testers can't even think about! They can simulate EVERYTHING tens of thousands of betatesters could possibly do and think and attempt in this game.

PS: If you find sarcasm, you may keep it.

Originally posted by originalegg

Originally posted by ganton

Originally posted by originalegg

Originally posted by ganton

Originally posted by local93bc

Well it looks like EQ1 alright. reminds me of it alot. Graphicx wise...

Is that a bad thing? Absolutly not. Just means that many more players can actually run it on there computers.

Lets just say. I rather see this game launch then any more Wow alike.

I think its time everyone exepted Wow as the grand champion Of the Wow Wars.Let them have there 12 millon players.

I think this game has more chance of geting 12 million sub's then any wow clones  made in the last 2 years.

 

Its time for somthing diffrent

+

+

Sorry but this game is for the niche hardcore pvp player crowd theres no way it can ever get anywhere near 12 million. Honestly their planning on launching with one server that supports up to 10k players from what I hear on these boards so theoretically they themselves are only looking at around 30k players.

 

wow very wrong and you have officially lost all credibility.

find me a link to where they are saying they will only have one server on release.  oh wait you cant?

Of course because anyone that doesnt agree with you is a troll right??? What are you a communist how about you let others have their own beliefs. I think you need to actually read my post as I said "from what I hear on these boards". Meaning thats not official but what some people have said on these forums. So why dont you apply that troll in front of your name because you have of yet to refute my evidence only flame my posts based on your opinions.

 

lol

You're starting to look like nothing but a bitter, angry, frothing attacker of anyone who does not share your belief in DF at the moment original. Just thought I should point that out, what with your one-line replies, nitpicking over definitions, attacking people who don't even "attack" your game but just point out its market.

Not a good representation of the community in DF to be honest.

Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by vehementi

So what would be the problem with having a 200 ping, again?  That means the server gets your packets in 100 ms, so you're really only 100 ms behind the server.  Is that going to be long enough to make it so you can never hit a guy because he's elsewhere?  have you read somewehre that there is no prediction etc. and that if you miss a guy on the server but not your client you lose?

 

Personally I would not play any fps game on a server with 150+ ms, normally I would expect about 40 ms. It is definately noticeable imo even if it is only one tenth of a second.

Considering its just a beta server, and absolutely no one is complaining about the ping, I would saw not to wrry. But trolls will look for whatever they can. 

Bwahaha. I'm a Troll again. Geeze people, you are really getting silly. I'm posting a legit worry about the game and all you can say to it is "Troll looking for whatever he can?".

Yeah...no wonder people are grumpy towards DF supporters.

Originally posted by vehementi

So what would be the problem with having a 200 ping, again?  That means the server gets your packets in 100 ms, so you're really only 100 ms behind the server.  Is that going to be long enough to make it so you can never hit a guy because he's elsewhere?  have you read somewehre that there is no prediction etc. and that if you miss a guy on the server but not your client you lose?

...It's a problem because it causes you to be at a disadvantage compared to other players. You can wave the word "skill" and "prediction" around all you want, but fact is, people with higher pings will be severely disadvantaged in this game.

I posted this before. A game like WoW/LOTRO etc. can easily be played with 300-500ms ping without you being at a huge disadvantage. The same can not be said about DF. That is a fact that comes with it being FPS, no target-locking.

Why are we arguing this again?

Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by singsofdeath 

And that is one group of people that will never play this game. Simple as that. Why would I play a game if I can't play it with my friends?

Maybe you wouldn't, maybe you would find new people to play with.

I personally would not expect to be able to play a fps style game who's server is located on a different continent and have a first class experience.

I suspect that this game will be far more popular with the fps and cross genre gaming crowd than with pure mmorpger's.

That may be true, actually I think that this is highly possible. However it is a "worry". It IS still an MMO first and foremost, at least from what I gather and cutting off the ability (at least the acceptable ability) for US and EU players to play together is cutting into a lot of people's friend-circles these days.

With the Internet being what it is, there's quite a few people who play with people from all over the world I should think. And these people will basically have no chance to play with their folks as they are used to, not if they want satisfying performance.

Unless Aventurine has some miracle trick that they haven't revealed yet. We shall see, but anyway, that's just my worry there. We will see when it comes out. ^^

Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by singsofdeath

Please...do not compare Shooters to a MMORPG, particularly not one as huge as Darkfall. Shooters have limited customization, limited areas and even then, if you want to be really successful, you still don't join Servers with more than 100ms Ping and that is an absolute max.

 Now, imagine this:

I play with my friend from the US. He has to connect to European servers. We get jumped by someone. We fight. He has a Ping of 300ms I have 60 and so does the attacker. Me and the other guy are sort of on even grounds, but my friend will be totally lost. he won't place a single blow on the enemy, unless he's extremely lucky, much less a spell or a heal on me because whenever he "targets" something, that target is actually already someplace else.

 Don't try to downplay this issue. It's a mjor concern and one that they have yet to say anything about except "we have a solution". You said it yourself, lag is a fact of life and lag in a FPS based game = problems.

 

If your friend is playing from the US he will have lag.  So he can either put up with it or play on a US server.  You wouldn't play on a cod4 server with 300 ping. 

I am sure that "we have a solution" is refering to normal lag, not self inflicted lag caused by people playing on servers on different continants.

Realistically he will not be able to play lag free US - EU.  Beta testers have said that they have 150 ms if they are playing from the US.

And that is one group of people that will never play this game. Simple as that. Why would I play a game if I can't play it with my friends?

Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by singsofdeath 

And what about those of us who like to play with friends from America and live in Europe? And they might have talked about Lag...but how can they -HONESTLY- judge that, having played it on a LAN Network and not on any kind of real MMO Infrastructure?

 

Lag/Latency is still my biggest worry about Darkfall. I still can't see how they want to adress these issues, but I'm willing to let them surprise me. After all, i will get to test it for free, so I'm not particularly worried.

 

That, and the completeness of the features and the atmosphere in the community might be a big turnoff. MIGHT, will have to wait and see though.

 

I don't see how this will be a problem, people play counterstrike, cod4 and other fps games and put up with lag, it is something that is sometimes unavoidable.  If you play with friends in US from Europe you will probably have lag no matter what.  Lag is a fact of life in online gaming, as long as it is not abnormally bad in DF then I doubt people will care.

Please...do not compare Shooters to a MMORPG, particularly not one as huge as Darkfall. Shooters have limited customization, limited areas and even then, if you want to be really successful, you still don't join Servers with more than 100ms Ping and that is an absolute max.

Now, imagine this:

I play with my friend from the US. He has to connect to European servers. We get jumped by someone. We fight. He has a Ping of 300ms I have 60 and so does the attacker. Me and the other guy are sort of on even grounds, but my friend will be totally lost. he won't place a single blow on the enemy, unless he's extremely lucky, much less a spell or a heal on me because whenever he "targets" something, that target is actually already someplace else.

Don't try to downplay this issue. It's a mjor concern and one that they have yet to say anything about except "we have a solution". You said it yourself, lag is a fact of life and lag in a FPS based game = problems.

Originally posted by vehementi

Originally posted by Alienovrlord

 

Very interesting to finally start to see information about the game.     Unfortunately it's through the eyes of a forum moderator so it naturally will have a heavy dose of enthusiam/fanboyism.    I'd like to see them allow some Gaming magazine reviewers a shot at the game. 

Originally posted by Seggallion

 every blow you score must be calibrated. If the target moves, you won’t hit it. You need to study its movements to understand where it’ll be an half a second later, and then target there so your blow can score efficiently.

 

Sounds great on paper but I wonder how Aventurine has worked out the little problem that gamers know as 'lag'?    Particularly in large battles since the reviewer makes mention of an 'army' being effected by weather. 

Maybe they really do have some incredible solution to this fundamental problem that has plagued online gaming since its invention.   We'll see in a month. 

 

Perhaps you could look to the beta feedback that expressly talks about lag, and says that it's very consistent and isn't a problem until you're very good at the game?  And then consider that there will be US servers so if everyone plays on their local server they'd have ~100 ping time like all the Euros apparently have to the Euro server?

And what about those of us who like to play with friends from America and live in Europe? And they might have talked about Lag...but how can they -HONESTLY- judge that, having played it on a LAN Network and not on any kind of real MMO Infrastructure?

Lag/Latency is still my biggest worry about Darkfall. I still can't see how they want to adress these issues, but I'm willing to let them surprise me. After all, i will get to test it for free, so I'm not particularly worried.

That, and the completeness of the features and the atmosphere in the community might be a big turnoff. MIGHT, will have to wait and see though.

Originally posted by winter

Originally posted by originalegg

Originally posted by Xzen

Even if some one has played it they can't tell you that they have. Again. Don't even bother trying to say that it looks better than AoC or Lotro because you'll be dissapointed. Again. It looks great but not better.

 

Um except for the people who have played it and are allowed to tell us....

 

 Come come now can you say BS hype? I'm sure even you can agree DF won't have 100x100 battles with graphics better then AoC. Not saying AoC has 100x100 battles but its graphics are better. Actaully I'd like to know what super computer these guys are playing with that they can have 100x100 battles with the graphics turned up so high they surpass Lotro/AoC's.

  Such posts from the hand picked italian guys iof anything prove any doubters opinions that they just aren't honest/objective.

 

It's because DF's developers are better at making a graphic engine than anyone else. It#s been repeatedly said that thier engine is better than anything out there to support large-scale battles at superior graphics.

That's what they say anyway....

All right....let me see if I understand this correctly.

They have stated that most (not all) of the game content will be soloable. This is a pretty normal thing in modern days MMO's. The fact of the matter is that you -can- do most things solo, but most of us don't because it's more fun to run with friends.

If they would say that most of the game MUST be soloed, then I would worry about things. Then I would give these worries credit. As it stands though, this sounds exactly like any other MMO on the market right now, giving soloers the ability to progress (but not experience everything) and making everything accessible to groups, reserving the top content for groups only.

I don't know how that makes the game a Singleplayer-game in any way.

Originally posted by mutantmagnet

 

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Well, serious Gaming magazines will not review the game/Beta like that. You don't go to a publisher and have them hovering around you while you are testing/playing and actually "helping" you play. That's beside the point really.

---

 

What are talking about? This happens a lot. How do you think closed sessions at E3 work? Do you actually read what the previews say at some place like IGN or do you have a memory problem?

As for my mistake by mistaking unproven for unprovable you made a good point.

Why is it that you can't do a reply without insulting the people you reply to? Is your fanatism about this game that huge?

Maybe my gaming magazine has different standards than those you read does, but the only one that I read and trust (and that is not any Gaming SITE, but a printed magazine), has strict policies regarding their testing. They need to be able to test the game alone, by themselves, without Dev's looking over their shoulders all the way. Anything before that, anything like what Aventurine did here, they will not give a full review.

Simply spoken, if Dev's hover around you and show you only what they want you to see, how can you really review a game? You can't. You've got a biased view on the game that way, not an objective opinion.

Now, maybe next time you reply to someone, you'll keep the insults to yourself, mh? 

Originally posted by Zorvan

Well, here ya go. As usual, turns out Tasos stays true to form:

"We have allowed 2 journalists from MMORPG Italia to do a review of Darkfall beta. They have been playing for a few hours here at our offices and we've been helping them out. They requested this visit over a month ago and we agreed. We'll do the same for any professional gaming media that's interested to come here and get a hands-on experience of the game. We will allow media wider access to the beta soon enough, but for now this can only happen on site.

We have not lifted the NDA, but we have allowed them access just for their review, but not to answer questions after this is out. We will ask you to respect this, and our willingness to share information about the game, even when there's an active NDA. We take the NDA very seriously, for the good of the game. This is still a testing process.

They have taken some screenshots and I'm sure they'll have a lot to say about the game in the days to come:

http://www.mmorpgitalia.it/forum/f29...nshots-212903/ "
 

The journalist are not exempt from the NDA. They only say what Tasos allows them right now and are allowed to say nothing once they leave.

So this whole thread topic has become pointless, seeing as how it is false.

Play for a couple of hours with Dev's lurking behind them and looking over their shoulders all the time while they write a review.

Well, serious Gaming magazines will not review the game/Beta like that. You don't go to a publisher and have them hovering around you while you are testing/playing and actually "helping" you play. That's beside the point really.

So, my worries about the state of the game remain, while the people who continue crying that it is completely inexistant are really starting to look a bit silly now. However, launch this year....mhhh? It's looking less likely, but I'll not pass judgement till the beginning of December when open beta is supposed to end.

Originally posted by downtoearth

Originally posted by xzyax

Originally posted by Ozmodan

Just a thought here, the beta testers have not progressed very far at all in the game due to multiple characacter wipes and features being turned off.  It is pretty hard to grasp the nature of crafting using very low skilled characters.  

I think you should wait until we get a better idea of how complex it actually is.  UO had a very similar crafting system that worked very well.  We are just going to have to be patient and see if Darkfall continues that success. 

That part I high-lighted above is my biggest beef with Aventurine, the Devs., and DarkFall.

 

Umm.... it's 5 weeks or less until the game is supposed to be released.  Wouldn't NOW be a good time to start releasing this kind of information?  Shouldn't we at least have an idea of how some of this stuff works?

 

I wouldn't mind knowing how many servers, where they will be hosted, the montly sub. cost either... but I guess that can wait until the day it's released too. 

 

For the OP... I agree with your initial assessment.  An "average" crafting system was not what I was hoping for.  One that works "on par" with what we had in UO was not what I was hoping for.  What is wrong with wanting something BETTER than everything else out there?  Or even, BETTER than what we had in UO... that game is 10 years old for crying out loud! 

Anyway... I guess hoping for something that was actually a step ABOVE in regards to crafting was probably a waste of time.  

they already said they wasnt going to release that info.

plus tasos already said they didnt try to reinvent the wheel for crafting. waite he was being honest geese
 

Quote from the Website's FAQ:

" In Darkfall, all items in the world can be made by the players.

Darkfall?s crafting system is intuitive, non-repetitive, challenging, useful, fun - and profitable. Using Darkfall?s virtually limitless item creator system, you could invent and be the first to use a weapon as awesome as the Flamefury Raudstaal Battleaxe of Bloodshed, or just make a simple saddle for your horse.

Bring your goods to market using Darkfall?s sophisticated and secure trading system, bringing buyers and sellers together easily whether they?re inside the game or not. "

I dunno....that sounds pretty awesome and also very innovative for me. Though it seems they've taken a step back from that? Or did I just misinterpret the FAQ information?

Originally posted by mutantmagnet

 

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And I said where that the beta is false? I said it is unproven that there is a beta, there is a difference. If you're gonna put words in my mouth,. make sure they fit first. The last thing this game or its developers could ever cause me is worry. The fanbois get to have all the worries, not me.

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False
1: not genuine <false documents> <false teeth>
2 a: intentionally untrue <false testimony> b: adjusted or made so as to deceive <false scales> <a trunk with a false bottom> c: intended or tending to mislead <a false promise>
3: not true <false concepts>
4 a: not faithful or loyal : treacherous <a false friend> b: lacking naturalness or sincerity <false sympathy>
5 a: not essential or permanent —used of parts of a structure that are temporary or supplemental b: fitting over a main part to strengthen it, to protect it, or to disguise its appearance <a false ceiling>
6: inaccurate in pitch <a false note>
7 a: based on mistaken ideas <false pride> b: inconsistent with the facts <a false position> <a false sense of security>
8: threateningly sudden or deceptive <don't make any false moves>

un·prov·able

That cannot be proved or verified by any test

 

Please shut up before you annoy me further with your illogical thoughts. Yes unprovable isn't the same as false but unprovable essentially means the same thing.

Unprovable /= Unproven.

Unprovable would mean that something CANNOT be verified. Unproven just means it HASN'T been verified -YET-.

Whatever I may think of the rest of this discussion, your lengthy quote from a dictionary did not do anything to strengthen your point.