All Posts by Vicksburg

Originally posted by Solude

"WAR will have 10 different classes per Realm, while WoW has all the same classes for each realm."

Thats kind of a half truth since classes on either side are copies of the other and only 1 race can play a particular class.  So though more total classes, after taking out dups and adding race restrictions its much more limiting in the search for your toon.

Really there are really only two things wrong with WoW, dated graphics and most of us are capped out and just burnt out.  I'd love for WAR to be in 2008 what WoW was in 2004.  Time will tell.

And a class in Wow can have different functions.

A druid or Pala can be a tank, a healer or a dps machine.

meaning one class with 3 complete different roles. The respec  costs these days is ... 4 daily quests.

How many hybrid classes with so diverse roles are there in Warhammer?

Originally posted by PROdotes

ah... vick.. one of the resident trolls we feed from time to time so we dont get bored hehe

But i DO have to ask you.. ok... w mmo with underwater content is what i missed for a long time... especialy since almost every mmo has "wather breating" and no use for it... but why are you always repeating the same points over and over and over...

yes... there wotn be flying mounts... but no one wants them anyway... how often do warhammer chars have flying mounts in the miniature games?

yes... they cut out 4 citeys so let's say 4 zones... but we still have 40 other zones to play in... and we got castles instead of the 4 zones...

and that's more or less all of the important poitns you mentioned... or was there something else?

About 15 to 20% of Warhammer miniatures are flying units btw.
 

And Paul himself said 18 months ago they didn't include flying units because of the extra funding needed.

Real 3D seamless open worlds without 2D "passage" borders are far more difficult to program.

I wouldn't go into the details, but a LOT more didn't make it in "Warhammer" or should I say the camoufflaged DAoC2.

What about mounted combat, what about the tanks you see in Warhammer, the dwarves heli's...A few hundred other things. Of course you can' t put it all in. But ...

Take the Warhammer scale for instance: so important in the miniatures game. In the MMORPG there are so fast day/night cycles you'd think you're back in the 90's RPG's.

We will have a DAoC mechanism with instanced battlegrounds. The lore of Warhammer is just a sign on the box.

-------

But like always I'll conclude with the "achilles" of WAR: the PvP fights themselves and the very limited replay value of an ever returning city siege battle, always preceded with the same public quests.

Of course you don't think it will be that bad. Ok let's wait and see the characters in the "epic" fights and the public quests (re)cycles.

My eyes were opened with Conan and their end game grind to a siege system.

PvP/RvR is a good way to play in the end game but helas it doesn't have enough staying power after X weeks. Certainly not with a capped gear game mechanism.

Guys wake up:

Here are the the sales of amazon.com

http://www.amazon.com/s/qid=1217633695/ref=sr_pg_1?ie=UTF8&rs=229575&bbn=229575&rh=n%3A468642%2Cn%3A229575&page=1

Age of Conan is already WEEKS out of the top 50 of PC sales.

I believe last time I saw it was on place 72.

Complete crash in sales and complete crash in Xfire (from 60.000 to 13.000 in 6 weeks time).

Today on Xfire at 13.800.

A month ago at 60.000 + ... incredible: this means the public just doesn't like it.

If Wow is between 400.000 and 450.000 in these Xfire played stats (with 4.5 million subs in US/EU),, ...

it would mean that with 13.800 Conan is already  under the 150 K subscriptions

... after 2 months.

This could be the death penalty when WArR and WotLK will hit stores within 3 months. Both target the same PvP public and open world Sieges; albeit with different angles, but I don't see Conan finishing this year with more than 100 K subs.

Originally posted by needalife214

Originally posted by Cochran1

Originally posted by ZeppelinJ0

Originally posted by Vicksburg

The big difference from a Wow player ???

WAR is being made at 1/50th of the development resources Blizzard has.

And it shows ! ....

hence no seamless open worlds, but LOADED screens between zones

hence no underwater worlds.

hence no flying units (and Warhammer lore is FULL of flying units).

and about a 66% cut in the promised siege cities even 3 months before release.

Those still believing that WAR has better PvP animation : you just type Warhammer video in Google and look at ALL the video stuff you can find.

The argument of 2 years old or one year old or players NOT used to playing were already raised here a million time. Mostly I think the videos are being played by some 80 year old.

No excuses:  the PvP fighting in War is slow with "gliding" characters and incredibly stiff. Even LOTRO had better animated avatars (and that says a LOT).

The end result is that you'll end up with DAoC2 (the days are short) but this time with battleground instances (with server clusters lol) and a very slow leveling process through endless public quest grinding to finally come to a "deus ex machina" - a final capitol battle every 2 weeks or so .... of which half(!) will be instanced btw (making the "famous" final epic open world pvp rather "small").

NO PVE raiding at all (unless you want to call ONE instanced end boss a viable raid.)

Also the fact your avatar turns into a chicken when entering lower zones is a real laugh.

The makers of WAR themselves (with the ever present and yelling "Led Zeppelin" Paul on top) already stated that Warhammer is an "awesome"  game and not even an open ended MMORPG in the real sense.

Mind you "awesome" in Paul's view is a rather often used word to describe something that has been seen in about every MMORPG ever published in the last 5 years.

The professions are far too limited, the world far too small (certainly after the 66% cut in City sieges) and the end game is purely based on RvR with EVER repeating grind to...

reconquer what you already conquered before.

Every 2 weeks or so.

Suddenly for the fans, instanced battlegrounds are not that negative anymore ...

....and of course the big difference between War and Wow is that War  will be the 9th Wow killer in a row.

The others can be found in the trash bin at 5 Euro a piece.

happy gaming.

 

Do you also wipe Blizzard's ass after they crap?

 

Funny, to be a WoW fan he spends more time in WAR forums than acutal WAR fans.

 

i love how none of this is true  lolzer  vicks GTFO

None is true? Wow I am excited than to watch the underwater worlds and my personal flying mounts :))
 

Originally posted by Cochran1

Originally posted by ZeppelinJ0

Originally posted by Vicksburg

The big difference from a Wow player ???

WAR is being made at 1/50th of the development resources Blizzard has.

And it shows ! ....

hence no seamless open worlds, but LOADED screens between zones

hence no underwater worlds.

hence no flying units (and Warhammer lore is FULL of flying units).

and about a 66% cut in the promised siege cities even 3 months before release.

Those still believing that WAR has better PvP animation : you just type Warhammer video in Google and look at ALL the video stuff you can find.

The argument of 2 years old or one year old or players NOT used to playing were already raised here a million time. Mostly I think the videos are being played by some 80 year old.

No excuses:  the PvP fighting in War is slow with "gliding" characters and incredibly stiff. Even LOTRO had better animated avatars (and that says a LOT).

The end result is that you'll end up with DAoC2 (the days are short) but this time with battleground instances (with server clusters lol) and a very slow leveling process through endless public quest grinding to finally come to a "deus ex machina" - a final capitol battle every 2 weeks or so .... of which half(!) will be instanced btw (making the "famous" final epic open world pvp rather "small").

NO PVE raiding at all (unless you want to call ONE instanced end boss a viable raid.)

Also the fact your avatar turns into a chicken when entering lower zones is a real laugh.

The makers of WAR themselves (with the ever present and yelling "Led Zeppelin" Paul on top) already stated that Warhammer is an "awesome"  game and not even an open ended MMORPG in the real sense.

Mind you "awesome" in Paul's view is a rather often used word to describe something that has been seen in about every MMORPG ever published in the last 5 years.

The professions are far too limited, the world far too small (certainly after the 66% cut in City sieges) and the end game is purely based on RvR with EVER repeating grind to...

reconquer what you already conquered before.

Every 2 weeks or so.

Suddenly for the fans, instanced battlegrounds are not that negative anymore ...

....and of course the big difference between War and Wow is that War  will be the 9th Wow killer in a row.

The others can be found in the trash bin at 5 Euro a piece.

happy gaming.

 

Do you also wipe Blizzard's ass after they crap?

 

Funny, to be a WoW fan he spends more time in WAR forums than acutal WAR fans.

And apparenlty knows a LOT more about the game than most fans believe :)))

The big difference from a Wow player ???

WAR is being made at 1/50th of the development resources Blizzard has.

And it shows ! ....

hence no seamless open worlds, but LOADED screens between zones

hence no underwater worlds.

hence no flying units (and Warhammer lore is FULL of flying units).

and about a 66% cut in the promised siege cities even 3 months before release.

Those still believing that WAR has better PvP animation : you just type Warhammer video in Google and look at ALL the video stuff you can find.

The argument of 2 years old or one year old or players NOT used to playing were already raised here a million time. Mostly I think the videos are being played by some 80 year old.

No excuses:  the PvP fighting in War is slow with "gliding" characters and incredibly stiff. Even LOTRO had better animated avatars (and that says a LOT).

The end result is that you'll end up with DAoC2 (the days are short) but this time with battleground instances (with server clusters lol) and a very slow leveling process through endless public quest grinding to finally come to a "deus ex machina" - a final capitol battle every 2 weeks or so .... of which half(!) will be instanced btw (making the "famous" final epic open world pvp rather "small").

NO PVE raiding at all (unless you want to call ONE instanced end boss a viable raid.)

Also the fact your avatar turns into a chicken when entering lower zones is a real laugh.

The makers of WAR themselves (with the ever present and yelling "Led Zeppelin" Paul on top) already stated that Warhammer is an "awesome"  game and not even an open ended MMORPG in the real sense.

Mind you "awesome" in Paul's view is a rather often used word to describe something that has been seen in about every MMORPG ever published in the last 5 years.

The professions are far too limited, the world far too small (certainly after the 66% cut in City sieges) and the end game is purely based on RvR with EVER repeating grind to...

reconquer what you already conquered before.

Every 2 weeks or so.

Suddenly for the fans, instanced battlegrounds are not that negative anymore ...

....and of course the big difference between War and Wow is that War  will be the 9th Wow killer in a row.

The others can be found in the trash bin at 5 Euro a piece.

happy gaming.

Originally posted by 123123456202

heres my numbers and order of release

1.War

2.LORTO EXPANSION

3.WotLK

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1.War-first month sales 1.6 million boxes sold (minimum)

2. LORTO EXPANSION- 50k (max)

3. WotLK- 2 million boxes sold (minimum)

 

 

 

P.S. I HATE WOW!!!!

Players who HATE games should see a Doctor.

And btw where is that other Wow killer now these days????

You know that game that had 1 million Beta requests before launch and now isn't even in the top 30 of PC... games anymore. Stopped at 700K after 6 weeks and now relegated at selling 20 K each month with Xfire stats showing they just lost 70% of their players after ... 8 weeks launch. (60k to under 18k on Xfire)

As War has 750 K Beta demands, they should be lucky to gather 600K instead of 1.6 million.

Originally posted by theJexster

Lack of depth and character development.  Lack of immersion. Lack of uniqueness per character.

No explaining of these terms is cheap hate;like we are used to in MMORPG.COM

Your post is a joke.

11 million players playing the game is a reality. learn to live with it.

Originally posted by Majinash

logic > Vick.

 

You've seen videos of WAR played by people who have spent maybe a few weeks in game, yet the only WoW PvP videos that count are ones played by professional gamers?  thats why people think you are an idiot, because you seem to be completely oblivious to your double standards.  you link to a rogue vs rogue video to show off the spell of WoW fights, why not ret pallys with 2handers? arms warriors? warlocks?

 

WoW PvP is so horribly unbalanced that you can win pressing 2 buttons, and the other person stands ZERO chance.  thats why the pally 1v1ed the warrior, he said no matter how good the warrior is, he can't win.  so you just pressed 2 buttons, didn't even auto attack!  how is that fast PvP? these are people in S3 and some S4 epics, they have high arena rating but because its a pally vs an arms warrior it doesn't count.

 

and sorry, the ghost gnome there doesn't mean the video I linked was staged, it means it was a 2v2 where 1 on each team DIED, you say you know plenty about arena, but you don't know this?

 

WoW PvP is either horribly slow, or stunlock death in 5 seconds.  when playing my friends PvE rogue, I can kill people in about 7-8 seconds, cheapshot, mutilate spam, KS, more mutilate spam, evisc.  they don't even get to fight back, the entire fight I'm standing still behind them.  when I'm on my friends prot pally fights never end, and don't get me started on my warlock.

 

Keep looking at rogues using 1.5speed daggers and thinking PvP in WoW is fast, go look up some Lineage 2 videos of fully buffed daggers or tyrants who attack ten times faster.  even L2 PvP is better than WoW PvP, and that game is horribly balanced too.

Wow PvP is pure MMORPG genious made by the BEST PC game designer of the last 10 years.

Ignoring this and you end up with all those other newly launched MMORPG's on the trash bin.

The hate is so true you don't even see anymore the 11 million people that  pay to play this game.

1051 weeks on the number ONE game being played and the ONLY game in the top 10 where you have to PAY to play.

Yea we are all morons who like to play Wow.

LOL !!!

Originally posted by Kurush

 

EQ2 or Vanguard crafting blow away that of WoW.

EQ2's amount and depth of raid content blows away that of WoW.

GW's arena PvP blows away that of WoW.

DAoC or EVE's world PvP blows away that of WoW.

DAoC or L2's siege PvP blows away that of WoW.

HAHAHAHA

And WOW BLOWS away ALL other MMORPG's in both

NUMBER of Players AND subscriptions

ALL these MMORPG"s COMBINED don't even come to the HEELS of Wow

And why ???

because YOU Sir are BLINDED by hate,

Originally posted by fuzzylojik

Originally posted by Vicksburg

Of course PvP in Wow is excellent....  in the fights .... It's the speed that counts,

NOT the hairs on your head.

That's why I showed the new vdieo footage with the new lightning and shadow casting in my OP.
 

The PvP WAS already more fluent, fast, hectic than other (stiff) MMORPG animations , but the new graphics make it even more dynamic.

Balance of classes these days is a rocket science to Blizzard tx to the analysis of Arena.

I just counted this evenings battlegrounds in WOW: in prime time at least 40 were active in each  BG on our server.

That's 160 battles going on ranging from 20 players to 80 players in each of the BG and (this +/- 6000 players) multiply it with dozens of Battlegroups (12 or more servers clustered).

That's tens of thousands of players who fight in the BG's - at the same moment -.EU servers only

Incredible that some would let you believe PvP is crap in Wow.

At level 70 you hardly have to wait for a BG to open (in fact for the horde it's zero waiting time).

So WOW PvP is very much being played,  it's very popular whatever the haters on this forum say on their visit to haters world. As for open world PvP: on PVP servers every night there are the open world daily quest fights in HALAA (Nagrand) and TEROKKAR fOREST, so here it depends on your server activity. Please play on a well known PvP server and have fun :))).

---

As for those guys who say that I never have a negative comment about Wow.

Well a few days ago I said that the new arena rated gear for BG's is an error from Blizzard.

People need to be motivated to play: with putting on a rating on 80% of the arena gear and a handful of BG gear, some people are demotivated to play, because they play with setups with friends just to enjoy the game. and will never arrive at 1550+ ratings.

Now arena becomes even harder to them and so motivation should always be high in a game.

Arena IS hard, and I am conviced that a percantage of those so called hard core Pvp-ers that want another game like WAR just had their heads offered too much in this competition.

It's always better to hide in the masses of some grey zone of world PvP than indeed have your personal (lacking) Arena ratings showed up on the armory of the internet or in game for inspection.

Having downed the bosses in Black Temple and having an arena rating (visible to everyone) of say a low 1375 is not some thing you want to show off do you?

That is the real reason some people complain (the old PVE raiders are NOT always the guys with the fastest eye-hand coordination) so they vent, but all in all it's up to Blizzard to solve this "embarassement" showing of all players ratings.

Like someone else said: a class is never balanced one on one, but in 5 vs 5 the class talents are the best tools to develop the classes further (and we've seen it in the last year already).

So yes, a lot of people are more than pleased to hide in the grey masses of so called world PvP, and I bet you these are exaclty the ones who SHOUT the most here as so called "real PvP-ers". Nothing could be fiurther from the truth of course.

... because the first condition of a game is balancing elements and up until now (excluding the techniques used in WotLK) world PvP in MMORPG's are based on ... complete unbalanced situations.

---

Last remark : next week the open world Pvp will already begin on the WotLK Beta servers.

See you there. :)))))

Tx for the support guys. The forum of World of warcraft is far from being owned by haters.

Tx.

 

 

Its the content that count and WoW lacks PvP content. 4 BGs and arena is sad after 4 years.

If you have 4 hairs on your head even if they are really big its worse than a full head of thin hair.

PvP animations were never the problem.  It is lack of PvP content.

Who cares about how full BGs are if there are only 4 BGs to play over and over.

I don't see WoW as faster or "frantic" as you call it than other mmorpgs on the market.

I got gladiator in arena and full s3 b4 i quit so your argument about not competitive does not hold water.

What's sad is there is a world but no world PvP.  Everything is packaged into instances for endgame PvP.

World PvP is still dead.  If you don't like massive world PvP what's the point of having an MMO?  Just play a multiplayer FPS.

WoW now consists of fighting in the same instances over and over.  It was fun for a while but it got boring fast.

World PvP is NOT dead on PVP servers in WOW. Proof of it every night in Haala.

besides this thread is about Wrath of the Lich King wich emphasis on an ORGANISED and BALACED world PvP zone (even on PVE servers - because PVP is ON automatically) ,

This time :...organised and balanced world PvP controlled by designers... Blizzard said  and I think they will deliver in view of their past track record.

.....

Originally posted by Majinash

So guess what I saw yesterday in IF?  it was this leet duel between 2 epiced out 70s, so it must have been totally fast, twitchy and exciting right?

 

One player stood still, never moved then entire fight, and pressed 2 buttons, they won.

 

Flash heal spam, consecrate every 8 seconds, thats all.  they managed to win standing still, pressing 2 buttons, and the fight only lasted about 2-3min.

 

So apparently that is fast paced leet action.  no thanks, you can have your leet WoW PvP, i'll enjoy not winning by standing still pressing 2 buttons.

 

oh, and for good measure, another really awsome tense - hard - frantic WoW arena fight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHJqUErv2iQ&feature=related

LOL
 

Good staging show. Those avatars wouldn't survive 15 seconds in arena.

That's why it was staged with the Gnome standing still as a watcher for 3 minutes.

I laugh at the people that say Arena is about pushing 2 buttons: THEY are the ones gotting the 1200 lowest ratings and get owend all the time.

They are the ones with embarassing score on the armory websites as they scream Oh my God I want to have some world PvP.

It is good to be in the grey masses of world PvP when you only can bash 2 buttons.

Just watch the championships in arena and look how professional players play.

BTW the animation was 10 x better than War's - even with this staging battle.

Within a few days the open world PvP of WOTLK begins on Beta.

So we are DISCUSSING present and future WotLK NOT Wow anno 2007 :))))

1. Avatar controls are very different and that's a personal taste of course for PvP.

2. Preloading of zones and hopping from one point to another makes it far less immersive. RP element is gone.

3. Lack of consistent PVE worlds makes it a cross between TF2 and an MMORPG like Wow or LOTRO.

Imagine if GW had a subscription rate just like Wow.... because as a free game it still has only about 5% of the playing time Wow has (see Xfire samples).

If it was that good for most people  it would easely be the number one played game by a long shot.

It is of course by far the best MMO-game for free, but it plays in another league at the moment.

I also see a lot of very young kids play it, because they can't afford (or allowed) subcriptions

GW lives from the sales of its expansion boxes and that's just way too short to survive on the long run if you would like massive consistent worlds and dungeons.

Even a 200K sub game makes more money than  a yearly expansion selling 1 million copies.

Originally posted by Yaros

 

---

Originally posted by Enforcer71

---

Originally posted by Yaros

 

 
 

---

Originally posted by coffee
There are 4 tiers to the map (ie capture T1 before you can move onto T2).

 

---

 
Lol, they are soooo copied WAR...

---

 

 
Hard to copy something that hasnt been released.. gotta love people who use this line

---

 

But actually they did it - they copied Mythic's idea. Mythic announced their tier system like 2 years ago. We didn't hear about such system from Blizz until now. I don't tell that copying good ideas is bad, if it works, more power for Blizz. But c'mon, they at least could change names or count of tiers. This shows also, they Blizzard thinks, that WAR ideas are good, if they are trying to copy them (but I am afraid if it would work in WoW, we will see).

LOL
 

HOW can you copy something from a game that isn't even published yet ????

By the sheer yelling of that guy named Paul ???

Blizz has manned tanks (not in War), air fights (not in War), anti air (not in War) and about ALL that gear was already PRESENT more than 4 years ago in the models of WOW at launch:

the airplanes taking off in ironforge, the siege engines and catapults were already in WARCRAFT 3 !!!!

So tell me: if 2 games publish at the same time, with ONE system having already all these elements in it YEARS ago, how could WOW have copied the (warcraft 3) siege engines ....

Blizzard works always YEARS in advance (it is NOT FUNCON you know). 8 years ago Death Knights were launched, 8 years ago siege engines could be played ... now they are in Wow.

Despite the yelling of "Led Zeppelin" Paul.

LOL

1 - 0 and no use to score because the referee just finished the match ! :))

Well today it went up again for the Xth day.

http://www.warcraftrealms.com/census.php?serverid=-1&factionid=-1&minlevel=10&maxlevel=70&servertypeid=-1

6.4 million played (that's almost 10% more then 3 weeks ago !)

OK let those July stats come !

http://www.amazon.com/s/qid=1217548198/ref=sr_nr_n_4?ie=UTF8&rs=468642&bbn=229575&rnid=11846801&rh=n%3A468642%2Cn%3A229575

http://www.amazon.de/Computerspiele-Games/s/qid=1217548238/ref=sr_nr_n_1?ie=UTF8&rs=300992&bbn=301129&rnid=541708&rh=n%3A300992%2Cn%3A301129

ALL new players :)))